Ep 37-The Naughty Nose Doc, Feat. "Don't Call Me Shazzer"

A marble‑and‑steel clinic, an in‑office CT scanner, and a surgeon who promised fast fixes for every sinus woe—then a trail of lawsuits, a vanished yacht guest list, and a fugitive life in the Alps. We pull back the curtain on the “Nose Doc” saga with Shannon, a seasoned ENT PA who explains what ethical sinus care really looks like and how this case veered so far from it. From love‑bombed romance to a billboard‑driven patient pipeline, the story moves from glossy branding into the hard realities of missed diagnoses, unnecessary surgeries, and the scars—physical and emotional—that follow.

Resources: 

“Based on findings from the New England Journal of Medicine (November 2023) and the American Heart Association’s 2023 sessions, Zilebesiran — an investigational RNA-based therapy — showed sustained blood pressure reductions for up to six months after a single injection.” https://clinicaltrials.gov/study/NCT04936035

“The Runaway Doctor” January 2011 https://archive.vanityfair.com/article/2011/1/the-runway-doctor

“Convicted ‘Runaway Doctor’ starts new life after prison, leaving former patient shocked” May 2021

https://www.nbcchicago.com/investigations/convicted-runaway-doctor-starts-new-life-after-prison-leaving-former-patient-shocked/2509943/

Dateline S29 E46: A Wanted Man, airdate May 14, 2021.  

Chapters

• 0:00 Warm Welcome And Guest Intro
• 3:45 Sponsor: Cheeky Night Guards
• 6:09 Shannon’s Background In ENT
• 9:12 Meet The “Nose Doc” Mark Weinberger
• 14:27 Lavish Life And Early Red Flags
• 18:52 In‑Office CT, Ethics, And Overdiagnosis
• 23:12 Assembly‑Line Care And Questionable Surgery
• 27:37 Missed Cancer: The Phyllis Barnes Case
• 32:12 Faked Images, Altered EKGs, And Lawsuits
• 35:27 Unnecessary Pediatric Surgery And Lasting Harm
• 39:42 Chart Note: New RNA Therapy For Hypertension
• 44:52 Cameras, “Scary Room,” And Greece Getaway
• 49:02 Abandonment, Debt, And Paper Trail
• 52:42 Life On The Run And Italian Alps
• 56:12 Monica’s Tip, Arrest, And Neck Stabbing
• 1:00:02 Extradition, Plea, Sentence, And Payouts
• 1:03:22 Post‑Prison Rebrand As “Yoga Doc”
• 1:05:52 Clinical Fallout: Laryngectomy And Impact
• 1:10:42 Sponsor: Quantum Squares
• 1:12:42 Medical Mishap: Pre‑Op Chaos
• 1:17:42 Reflections, Takeaways, And Closing

Transcript

SPEAKER_03: 0:43

Amanda!

SPEAKER_00: 0:45

Jenna!

SPEAKER_03: 0:47

How the heck are you? Doing real fine. How are you doing? Well, I think you and I are both extra happy because we have a super duper friend, special guest on your podcast today. Our guest. Anna. Shannon!

SPEAKER_00: 1:05

Jan Jackson!

SPEAKER_01: 1:08

Woo! Hello, ladies.

SPEAKER_00: 1:11

Shannon Shannon. Thank you for joining us.

unknown: 1:13

Ah!

SPEAKER_03: 1:14

I know we're so thrilled because first of all, I have to say Shannon is the person who introduced me. She's like my true crime podcast mentor because I was doing these long distance trips and my friends kept telling me, Oh, you shouldn't listen to podcasts. And I was like, whatever. Shannon came along, she's like, listen, these ladies, my favorite murder. I was like, okay, I'll give it a try. And OMG, I became hooked, and then it was morbid, then it was others, and then it was, well, we need to do our thing. So if it weren't for Shannon, I would never have known the pleasure of this world. So Shannon, thank you.

SPEAKER_01: 1:54

Yay, you are very welcome. I am still an avid listener of my favorite murder. Shout out Karen of Georgia. And I uh I've got plenty more to recommend if you are ever in the need.

SPEAKER_03: 2:06

Listen, are you a Karen or a Georgia in that scenario?

SPEAKER_01: 2:10

Ooh, I don't know. Let me let me be a Steven. Let me be a Steven. Steven!

SPEAKER_03: 2:17

I don't see a mustache, but I mean we can get there. Thank you.

unknown: 2:21

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03: 2:22

I appreciate that. Uh we're so thrilled to have you because besides your true crime expertise and and passion, you are an excellent provider. You are someone who you're you're a physician assistant who, in the last, I don't know, seven or years or more, correct me if I'm wrong, have specialized in your nose and throat. And we've learned so much, we continue to learn so much from you, but we're just really excited to have you on and to share your perspective with your story.

SPEAKER_01: 2:59

Thank you. I am very excited to be here.

SPEAKER_03: 3:03

Before you get started, though, we have a correction section. Which really, because it was Amanda's week last week, is there's nothing to say. She's impeccable. But this week was my weekend, we're late. So that's what we're talking about. Your girl decided to have 103.2 degree fever. Listen, when I get 99 point something, I feel like, oh my god, I'm dying. So the fact that it was 103.2 after Tylenol this weekend with a really bad cough, and the fact that I'm the editor and I don't want to have to deal with me coughing every two minutes. We decided to postpone until today. So hopefully it'll be, I mean, hopefully you find it worth it. And I so sorry. So that's the extent of the corrections. It's gonna be worth the wait because we got Shannon here to tell us a story today.

SPEAKER_00: 3:55

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SPEAKER_03: 5:13

That's an awesome deal. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00: 5:15

Yeah, that gun.

SPEAKER_03: 5:17

So as they say in England, I don't know why. Gary and Shannon and Karen all have abbreviations or affectionate nicknames. Gazer, Hazar, and Shazer. So Shazer? Shannon.

SPEAKER_02: 5:33

What's your story? Talk to us. Jenna. I hate nicknames.

SPEAKER_03: 5:41

I know. I'm so sorry. I mean, but you are Shazer too many of us. We have a lot of UK listeners. And they're gonna think, oh, Shazer, yeah, affectionately.

SPEAKER_01: 5:51

Listen, listen, you know what? I we just had another Shannon join our practice, and she is a medical assess a medical assistant, and she's great, but with two Shannons, it gets a little confusing. And I am going to have all of the staff listen to this episode. And you know what? Maybe now Maybe you're Shazer for life. Shazer.

SPEAKER_00: 6:12

But you actually also hate nicknames. So maybe Shannon 2.0 can be Shazer and you can be Shannon.

SPEAKER_01: 6:19

Maybe now they're gonna call me Shazer, and that's how they're gonna tell us apart. So thanks, Jenna. No, Shazer, Shazer works. I'm gonna pro maybe I'll propose that to her tomorrow and just gauge, see how she feels. All right. So first I wanted to give a little background about me, which ties into why I chose this story. My story today centers around an ENT physician, and since 2018, I have worked as a physician assistant in an ENT office. This man grew up in New York, and I also grew up in New York. The story partly takes place in Indiana, and I currently live and work in Indiana. So many little coincidences that just made this story too hard for me to pass up on telling. So I wanted to thank you ladies for giving me the opportunity to join you on your podcast and share this bonker story. I do want to put out a trigger warning for suicide. The story does briefly mention a suicide attempt. Additionally, most of the information that I gathered was from a 2021 Dateline episode that covered the story, as well as a Vanity Fair article by Buzz Bissinger from 2010. The rest of my sources will be listed in the show notes. So I mentioned that the story focuses on an ENT physician. For anyone who is unfamiliar, ENT stands for Ear, Nose, and Throat, otherwise known as odolaryngology. With the ears, we deal with anything from infections to hearing loss, where you lovely ladies play a huge role in helping us out. We could not do our job without you. Thank you. To removing bugs from the ears, which happens more often than you would like. With the throat that encompasses all of the mouth, all the way down to your voice box, so we're covering anything from tongue to throat cancer, tonsil issues, voice disorders, and more. But the nose is where we're going to be focusing our attention today. The nose can cause a lot of problems that we in ENT see, from nosebleeds to nasal congestion. But for one doctor, his main focus was on sinus disease, and he made a whole career out of it, even dubbing himself the nose doc. The story I'm going to be telling today is the story of a physician who truly had everything a person could possibly want. Things I really didn't even realize a person could actually have. He had a good, promising career. He had a wife who loved him, a lavish townhome, private drivers, a sushi chef, personal trainers, massage therapists. He had an 80-foot yacht. He had owned land in the Bahamas, and he also had a private membership to a private jet company. I didn't even really realize that people who were not like celebrities or famous people could have access to those sort of things. I just though that never even, that's not, that's, yeah, that just wasn't in my in my mind. Right. This is the story of the runaway doctor Mark Weinberger. Mark Weinberger was raised in New York, the middle child to prominent Jewish parents. Mark and his family are descendants of the kings and queens of Chop Liver. If you've ever heard that say, if you've ever heard that saying, so what am I, Chop Liver? Yes, well, that is from his grandmother, who started selling her chop liver recipe in Bronx supermarkets. And she and she For real?

SPEAKER_03: 9:31

What would that be a euphemism for? Just like, you know, my chop uh what am I chop liver?

SPEAKER_01: 9:38

You know, less than. Well, she ended up turning her little chop liver recipe into a two million dollar a year business. Nice girl. Okay, okay. And that was from 1950 to 1989. So imagine what that would and that was and that was decades ago. Imagine what she'd be raking in.

SPEAKER_03: 10:00

Okay, now I want to be chop liver. Listen, what am I? Chop liver?

SPEAKER_01: 10:05

I'm worth millions, maybe. Millions! Yeah, that's true. And anyway, Mark went to the University of Pennsylvania for his undergraduate degree, then went to UCLA for medical school, and then went on to the University of California, San Diego Medical Center, for his residency in ENT. He followed that up with a fellowship in Chicago at the University of Illinois, where he was one of only two fellows that were accepted that year. So it's pretty, I mean, it was I would call that prestigious. If there's only two people who are attending and you you get into it, I mean that's pretty, that's pretty good. Wow. Like that's competitive. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 10:42

Yeah. I mean, it's not a tiny school. I mean, it's the University, what, of San Diego? Well, this was when he was in Chicago, but still. Still. Yeah. I mean, yeah, they've got they've got plenty of applicants. Yeah. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01: 10:57

A lot of people, I'm sure, were vying for that spot, and he was only one of two people accepted. I had been talking about it with the surgeon I work with. Hey, Dr. Judge. And he said that the rhinologist who this Dr. Mark Weinberger had trained under was actually one of the top rhinologists in the country at that time. So it was just wild to me to think that this guy really had all the opportunity in the world and threw it all away. So a little timeline for anyone listening who is maybe not in medicine or is just curious about how long it takes to become an ENT physician. It is typically four years of undergraduate work to get a bachelor's degree, then four more years of medical school, then you need to get into a highly competitive ENT residency program, which is five years long. ENT is truly one of the hardest residencies to get into, at least in today's world. Not entirely sure how that was in the 1990s or in the 2000s, but at least today, you typically need to be in the top 10% of your medical school class to get accepted into an ENT residency. Once you've yeah, it is competitive. Once you've finished the residency, you then need to pass a board certification exam. And that is just if you want to be a general ENT surgeon. If you want to specialize in a specific field of ENT, like if you want to focus on the ears with autology or neurotology, or voice disorders with laryngology, you need to complete a fellowship, which could take an additional one to two years of training. Mark Weinberger completed a rhinology fellowship, which focuses on disorders of the nose and the sinuses. So Mark graduated from his fellowship in 1996 and began working in Merrowville, Indiana, which is a sort of shop suburb of Chicago. The area is full of steel mills, causing poor air quality and potentially leading to increased sinus problems amongst the population there due to an increased concentration of airborne pollutants. With a focus in sinus disease, kind of makes sense as to maybe why Mark chose that as his area that he wanted to kind of settle down and start his practice. In 2001, Mark got engaged to his third wife, a woman named Michelle, who was about 11 years or so younger than him. Their relationship started out like many courtships, with Mark showering Michelle in affection and vowing to treat her like a princess for the rest of your life.

SPEAKER_03: 13:14

Oh, wait, love moming?

SPEAKER_01: 13:17

Right? Okay. I didn't even get into the sort of like lavish lifestyle that they were living. Like I remember I mentioned he was a member of this like private jet that was at his beck and call. Like they would literally just jet off places on a land.

SPEAKER_03: 13:35

Should we raise the should we tie raise the tiny little red flag at this point?

unknown: 13:40

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 13:41

Are we gonna collect some flags? But first, the first little red, tiny little flag. Fluttering, fluttering, but like, okay, love bombing, watch out, ladies. Okay, carry on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 13:53

Just to sort of showcase the extravagant lifestyle that they had been living, you know, in addition to like the random vacations they would take, they got engaged in Rome at a piazza with singers serenading her. Michelle, however, wasn't completely blinded by his charm and soon began to see Mark's true colors, a side of him that would inevitably bleed into his work life as well. I don't have this in here, but it was it's been bothering me. I feel like I should, I should mention that Michelle, in everything that I've read and the things I've watched of her, to her credit, she really wasn't just like along for the ride. She was studying and in school herself. She did actually go on and get her PhD in psychology. So she did not, I mean, not that there's nothing, you know, if you want to be a trophy wife, like good for, you know.

SPEAKER_00: 14:43

And good on her for continuing that path that she was already on when she met him, because she certainly didn't have to.

SPEAKER_01: 14:49

But she she she was really trying. Like she was working, you know, she was younger than him, so she was still in school when they met. So she through all this, she was working for her own to have her own career. Anyway, just a little aside. But she was like, no, like this is what I want to do. I want to be able to help people in my own right, which she does end up saying in the dateline. She's like, I became a doctor in my own right, and she did. So Michelle, however, wasn't completely blinded by his charm and soon began to see Mark's true colors, a side of him that would inevitably bleed into his work life as well. She learned firsthand how he could be a callous, careless man with little empathy. Her father was diagnosed with stage four lung cancer shortly after their engagement, and instead of offering support and compassion, he complained that their fun, joyous lifestyle was going to end, and he even tossed around the idea of ending their engagement. He basically he basically just didn't want their like fun times to come to an end. This was gonna spoil his fun time.

SPEAKER_00: 15:47

He's like, this is really putting a damper on it if your dad could just not. Could he just not have cancer right now?

SPEAKER_01: 15:54

Uh oh, flag two of the flags. All of the flags. Wow. They ultimately did get married. They actually ended up having three separate celebrations. They moved up their wedding day so that Michelle's father would be able to walk her down the aisle. But don't think that this was a selfless act on Mark's behalf. Quite the opposite. He was at first adamantly against the change in their initial wedding date, telling Michelle that you can't let the dying people change what the living are going to do. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00: 16:24

Flag three! Flag three! Red flag, red flag.

SPEAKER_01: 16:30

Like her father is literally dying, and all she wants is to be able to have her father have the moment there with her. Like at this point, she's probably in her I didn't do the math, but she's probably in her early third, early twenties. I mean, all she wants is to be able to walk with her father down the aisle. Like I I got married last year and I was absolutely sobbing during my father-daughter dance. I absolut you know, I obviously cannot speak for every woman, but I'm sure that it's many girls' dreams to have that moment with their father and that he was just so what's the word? Just so just didn't care about her feelings. Like the woman that he's confessing his love to, professing his love to, is just so gross. And he's a doctor, he's a and he's a doctor. He didn't even want to go to the hospital with her to see him. Puke. What an ass. Yes, Amanda, as you would call him. He's a big puke. He's a big puke. He's a big puke. In 2002, Mark decided that he was going to open up his own state-of-the-art practice. I have state of the art in air quotes because it truly all was a facade. Like he wanted it to look all glitz and glam, but he was clearly trying only to impress his patients, people who would maybe not know any better. Uh-huh. He opens up his clinic with the help of his father, who loaned him one million dollars. That's that chop limited money. To per to purchase a CT scanner for his office.

SPEAKER_00: 18:00

Also, like, oh, you care about your dad, but we can't care about mine. Oh, only because yours gives you one million dollars. Okay, got it.

SPEAKER_03: 18:08

I mean, where's the empathy? The guy's dying.

SPEAKER_01: 18:11

Like now, if you've ever had a provider order a CT scan, you know that normally you need to schedule an appointment for this, then go to the hospital or another office and have it completed, then wait several days for the radiologist to read it, only to then wait another several days to hear back from your provider with the results. Mark figured that he would just cut out the middleman entirely and have the CT scanner in-house so his patients could just get it right done, done right there. Now, this is not unheard of. I did actually interview at an ENT practice that had their own CT scanner in the house, so it's obviously a thing. But this does raise some ethical questions to me, and I wanted to see what you ladies thought. So if you're the surgeon and you're getting a CT scan on a patient to determine if that patient needs surgery, wouldn't you want an unbiased opinion from the radiologist? Absolutely. Or if I was the patient, wouldn't I want an unbiased opinion from the radiologist? Presuming this man was reading his own T his own CT scans. I couldn't find anything that said one way or the other. What was stopping him from interpreting them however he wanted and then determining that every patient needed surgery? There was really no checks and balance system in place. This is this is this. This shouldn't look like that.

SPEAKER_00: 19:29

Well, yeah. And he can show them the images himself and just say, Yep, right here on this this slide. This is the one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 19:39

And they're not gonna know. I didn't I couldn't find anything that said one way or the other if he did or not. So I'm gonna assume now I don't know entirely. I'm just going to think he didn't. Well, shoot. When I was when I was with you girls and when I was with you guys in Minnesota, there was a radiologist who was dedicated to just the temporal bone, like a specific part of the body on a CT scan. Like that's what he focused on.

SPEAKER_03: 20:04

So he didn't have a radiologist that provided him or an interpretation and a report. Wow.

SPEAKER_01: 20:10

I'm just gonna choose to put the fourth red flag here. Now, I'm I'm just presuming so.

SPEAKER_03: 20:17

I mean, people are radiologists as a specialty for a reason. They spend all those years that you talked about the ENTs do, maybe not as many, but almost as many, learning how the intricacies of these scans and how to interpret them. So, yes, ENT then looks at that report and then decides whether it's relevant and what their own thoughts are. But ultimately, the radiologist is the expert in interpreting the scan, not another specialty.

SPEAKER_01: 20:49

And if that is the case, then there really is no checks and balance system in place. And to further prove my point, according to court documents, at least 90% of his patients were told on their very first appointment with him that they would need some sort of sinus-related surgical procedure to cure whatever ailment they had. And and in 2003, which is so his office has barely been open for maybe two years. In 2003 alone, he billed$13 million. And that's just one, that's just one person. Now, I try to find numbers. I asked, I tried to find numbers, I asked my surgeon who I work with, couldn't really tell me like what's a good number for a surgeon. This to me just seems insane. Just to me, screams fraud for one person to be billing in one year in the year 2003. I don't know, I don't know. That was one that was one year that he billed that much. Are you kidding me? Don't they say you lose money in that first startup period? So red flag number five. And now, if this is how much he was billing, I don't know how much he was making from that.

SPEAKER_03: 22:05

So he's not there's no oversight from other like administrators or billing professionals saying no, you can't do this.

SPEAKER_01: 22:12

So he's in a private practice, and in two years, so we all know, but still, that's a lot of money to be billing in one year by one provider.

SPEAKER_03: 22:21

Well, we all know whatever we bill, like when you start up a practice, you're building up your patient load, you're onboarding, and you shouldn't expect to make any money in private practice for at least two years. You can't even pay yourself.

SPEAKER_01: 22:38

That's that's what I would. I don't, I do not have that data, but that's what I would venture to guess as well. Yeah. He named his clinic the Weinberger Sinus Clinic, and under the massive sign off front was a sculpture of a face with a prominent nose. The interior. Oh no, I thought it was funny also. I was really hoping it was just gonna be like a big nose, but it was it was a face with a nose. But I the interior was decked out with nose-themed decor. He had stainless steel and marble fixtures, and it was equipped with a computer system that allowed him to bill the patient's insurance companies before they had even left an office. I'm not really sure how that worked with documentation because considering this was still early days of computers, that's actually sort of impressive. I had mentioned that he had his own CT scanner in-house, so he was really able to operate his own little one-stop shop clinic. But not only that, Jenna, like you mentioned, he was the only provider in his clinic, so he had no oversight. He didn't even have another surgeon in his clinic who could be like, bro, what are you doing? Yeah, it was his show and it was his way of the highway.

unknown: 23:49

Dr.

SPEAKER_01: 23:50

Weinberger's medical practice may have looked state-of-the-art from the outside, with its steely facade and quite literally on the nose decor. However, his medical technique was questionable. I can't speak to how sinus surgery was done in the early 2000s, but according to the article I read, even at that time, the technique he was using was outdated. With sinus surgery, a main goal is to open up the natural sinus openings, which are smaller than a pencil eraser, to allow for better sinus drainage. Dr. Weinberger was drilling holes into the back of the maxillary sinus cavities, which are your cheek sinuses. So instead of enlarging the natural opening of the cheek sinus, called a maxillary antrostomy, he was poking holes into the back, which for some led to more sinus infections because it really wasn't allowing for proper nasal drainage as was intended. Additionally, one medical expert joked that he would have he could have only operated with 12 hands because his operative nose indicate that he only took 25 minutes to perform his surgeries. When I would say that at least today, an endoscopic sinus surgery, where you're opening all eight sinuses, you have four on each side, should take at least 90 minutes, with the maxillary sinuses alone taking 30 minutes, according to the surgeon I work with. Right.

SPEAKER_03: 25:05

There's no accountability there. It was his show.

SPEAKER_00: 25:08

Well, I was gonna say, like tubes, bilateral tubes take like 15 minutes from start to finish.

SPEAKER_01: 25:14

So like this is a little more intensive than that. Yeah, a little bit, little bit. Not only was he performing substandard care in the operating room, which, by the way, was not located in a hospital, wasn't even located in an outpatient surgical center, but was actually just in the same building where he had his clinic. He was essentially running a patient mail from within those walls. He sometimes saw more than 100 patients a day. No, girl, I know. Doesn't it make your head just want to spin around in a circle?

SPEAKER_00: 25:49

What? What? Wow, I would really just feel like I'm getting excellent care there.

SPEAKER_02: 25:55

How is that possible? There's no way you can lay eyes on a hundred people. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 26:00

I'll tell you how. I'll I'll tell you how it was possible because he averaged three minutes per patient. See you for surgery. Do you know? I it I was thinking, how much can I get done in three minutes? I can literally introduce myself and sign into the computer in three minutes.

SPEAKER_03: 26:20

Hi, how are you? Can you verify your last name and your birthday? Great. Listen, off you go.

SPEAKER_01: 26:25

How three minutes on a full day, I see maybe 16 patients. And even then, sometimes I'm like, oh, that's crazy. This is why I take notes the other day because I'm like, who was that? That patient.

SPEAKER_00: 26:38

Yeah. He shouldn't even have a hundred patients a week.

SPEAKER_03: 26:41

A week? Five days? Five business days? There's no way that he met all of them. He had his nurses doing this stuff. Yeah. There's no way he went. You can't even shake hands with somebody in that amount of time. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_01: 26:53

How how 100 patients a day in three minutes? There's no way you can provide even remotely appropriate care with a schedule that burdens them. It's not safe for the patients nor the provider.

SPEAKER_03: 27:06

He's putting it all on his staff. He's walking in and going, hey, how's how's you doing? Yeah. And if they're lucky, they'll get instructions from the staff, from the nursing staff.

SPEAKER_01: 27:17

In three minutes, you're determining someone needs surgery. You're explaining to them the surgery procedure. You're telling them the risks and benefits, alternatives. In three minutes, no. If that. If that, if that. Well, one of those unfortunate patients was Phyllis Barnes, a 47-year-old who saw Dr. Weinberger in 2001 for a mix of problems, none of which screamed to me sinus. And now that is my ENT opinion here. She had been dealing with several months of a cough that occasionally had blood in it. She was losing weight, she was having trouble swallowing, and she began having trouble breathing. She was also a smoker. Now, if I had this patient come into my clinic, I would have concerns. At a minimum, I would do a full physical exam, including shining my little flashlight into her ears, her nose, and her throat. Hello, it's called ENT. I would also feel her neck because you have hundreds of lymph nodes throughout your neck that can become enlarged if you have an illness like an infection or cancer. Then, because I can't see all the way down your throat with just my flashlight, I would take what's called a flexible laryngoscope and take that through your nose and take a little peek down your throat. Now, it's my opinion that if you were to ask any ENT surgeon, physician assistant, nurse practitioner, and probably even the medical assistant who works with the above, they would be able to tell you that that is just the standard of care. But what did Marky Boy do? According to court filings, not much. Not much. He only performed a nasal exam, and then, no surprise, he ordered a CT scan of her sinuses. He performed surgery to remove nasal polyps, which did not improve her breathing as intended. Duh, because they were not there, and that was not the problem. What was the problem? Well, she would find out when she followed up with another ENT surgeon shortly after her post-op appointments with Dr. Weinberger, where he continuously brushed off her ongoing concerns. Her new physician stated that he was able to see a tumor in her throat easily upon exam, and he could feel enlarged lymph nodes in her neck. Phyllis had throat cancer. Her new physician was so confused as to how Dr. Weinberger could have missed the diagnosis that he even said that her cancer would have been obvious to a first-year medical student and that Dr. Weinberger either had on blinders or he simply didn't care. She would yeah, she would die of her illness in 2004, but not before getting her chance to sue Dr. Weinberger in 2002, telling in her deposition that her symptoms felt like somebody was hanging me by a rope. Her attorney made the decision to depose her, knowing that she would ultimately be speaking to a jury from her grave, which is exactly what happened. She ended up having total laringectomy. So it just made her. So for anyone who doesn't know, a laringectomy is when your entire voice box is removed. So you have to talk through a little, it's like a microphone that you hold to your neck and it helps create the sound as you're going to speak. And so that just even made her deposition all the more powerful.

SPEAKER_00: 30:23

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01: 30:25

Another patient who filed a civil suit against Dr. Weinberger was William Boyer. When William saw Dr. Weinberger in the office, he was shocked to be shown pictures from his exam, which showed bloody, pus filled polyps in his nose. He was advised that he needed surgery. But guess what? Those pictures he was They weren't of William. William was brought to surgery despite also having an EKG prior that showed an irregular heartbeat. Now that's not a contraindication to surgery, but given that this surgery was not necessary, it certainly should have been brought up in discussion for reconsideration. So how did Dr. Weinberger get around this glaring red flag? He simply crossed out the word abnormal on the patient's EKG and instead wrote in normal. Mr. Boyer's lawsuit would be one of the first in more than 350 cases filed against Dr. Weinberger.

SPEAKER_00: 31:17

Holy crap, 350 cases?

SPEAKER_01: 31:21

Okay.

unknown: 31:22

Woo.

SPEAKER_01: 31:26

In 2004, a concerned mother brought her eight-year-old daughter Kayla to see Dr. Weinberger after seeing an ad for him on a highway billboard. Her daughter was struggling with persistent, debilitating headaches. Kayla recalls her symptoms, stating that she was dizzy. I was nauseous. I was throwing up all the time, with her mother adding that she was beginning to lose her vision as well, and her head was growing to three times its normal size. But Dr. Weinberger assured them that he knew where the source of her problems lied. Her sinuses, of course. He operated on Kayla's sinuses at just eight years old. Now, it's pretty accepted in surgical practice that you don't operate on a child's sinuses unless you absolutely have to. Your sinuses are not developed fully at that age. Your sinuses develop at different, you know, at different stages at different ages. And so you certainly can't operate on all of the sinuses at eight years old. But again, she didn't have sinus disease in the first place. So he was doing an unnecessary surgery on an eight-year-old.

SPEAKER_00: 32:27

I don't even remember what red flag count we're on. I'm gonna say 12. Ugh, awful. Just awful.

SPEAKER_01: 32:35

Yeah, that sounds fair. So the cause of her symptoms was actually coming from a tumor on her pituitary gland, which is an endocrine gland about the size of a pea that's located at the base of the brain and is responsible for releasing hormones that aid in growth and development. Fortunately, her tumor was benign, but by the time she was seen in Chicago to have the tumor addressed, Dr. Weinberger had already made a mess within her sinuses, which is often used as an access point to get to the pituitary gland. She had so much scar tissue within her nasal cavity and sinuses that her new surgeons were only able to remove 10% of her tumor. Kayla survived her ordeal, and this woman truly is a badass. She took this traumatic childhood event and she owned it, fueling, using it to fuel her motivation to become a doctor herself. I love this quote from her. So she later went on to attend medical school and she said of her decision to pursue a career in medicine, it's not because of Weinberger, but in spite of him.

SPEAKER_00: 33:36

Okay, well, before we uh carry on any further into Shannon's story, it's time for a charno.

SPEAKER_01: 33:50

I fucked that all the way up.

SPEAKER_00: 33:52

We were all staring at each other like, how are we gonna do this tune, guys?

SPEAKER_02: 33:57

Who's going first? So is it you?

SPEAKER_03: 34:02

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 34:03

It can be you.

SPEAKER_03: 34:04

This was this was gonna be your week. You can do it. Welcome to the chart note segment where we learn about what's happening in medicine and healthcare. Love it. Today's chart note is about something new in medicine and honestly something hopeful. Because every once in a while, science surprises us, not with something flashy, but something practical. Something that could quietly change millions of lives. Let's talk about high blood pressure. About half the adults in the US have high blood pressure, and most of them take daily medication to manage it. Some people take two or three pills, and while those meds work, the daily routine, the remembering, the refilling, the side effects can wear people down. But researchers have found a simpler way. There's a new drug in development called I just have to say how to say it. Uh, and I forget now. Zilobsuran. Zelepsurin. Zelebsurin. And it's part of a new class of treatments that use RNA interference. So that sounds like science fiction, but here's the short version. Instead of blocking a chemical pathway after the fact, it goes right to the source. The genetic signal that tells your body to produce a hormone that raises your blood pressure. So with one, yes, one injection, zelebs run switches off the signal in the liver for months. In clinical trials, a single dose lowered blood pressure by more than 20 points and kept it there for half a year or longer. It works upstream in the Renin angiotensin aldosterone system, otherwise known as RAAS, for those people who are above my pay grade. Right. By inhibiting hepatic production of angiotensinos.

SPEAKER_00: 36:04

I am so glad I did not read this one.

SPEAKER_03: 36:07

Fewer downstream mediators of vasor constriction were activated. So in phase two trials, reductions in 24-hour systolic blood pressure of over 20 mmHg were achieved with single doses in some cohorts. The safety profile so far seems favorable with mostly mild injection site reactions and no major safety signals reported in published data. So, what does this mean? This means instead of taking a pill every morning, you might get a shot twice a year, and that's it. I mean, it's not ready for prime time yet. It's still in clinical trials, but early results look good. Strong blood pressure control, mild side effects, and no major safety red flags so far. And it's part of something bigger. RNA-based therapies, the same general idea between behind some of the COVID vaccines, are opening new doors for chronic diseases like cholesterol, diabetes, and even obesity. Medicine is learning how to turn down the volume, which for those of us in the audiology and ENT realm, turn it to the left, to the left, to the left. If you or someone you know has high blood pressure, this one is one to keep an eye on. It doesn't mean you don't have to take your meds, but it signals how medicine is evolving towards less frequent and more durable treatments. Ask your provider about what's coming in hypertension care. Stay informed because the landscape is shifting. Why is this story a bright spot? Because it's not just about new tech, it's about time. Every skip pill, every forgotten refill, every side effect adds up. A treatment that's effective, low maintenance, and long-lasting could give people back some of that time and maybe a little peace of mind. Imagine getting your blood pressure shot at your doctor's office once in January and once in July, and spending the rest of the year living your life. So the left I forget how we decided we were gonna say this. So the left turn turn still has more trials to go, and it's not a cure. But it's a glimpse of what's coming, a future where managing chronic conditions can be simpler, steadier, and just a little more human. And in a field that can feel full of burnout, cost, and chaos. That feels like something. Now back to the case.

SPEAKER_01: 38:29

In the summer of 2004, there were at least three malpractice suits already filed, and Dr. Weinberger had received a request from a lawyer to turn over the medical records of 18 former patients.

unknown: 38:41

Dr.

SPEAKER_01: 38:42

Weinberger could undoubtedly feel the walls closing in on him. It wasn't only the doctor who became suspicious. His wife noticed some oddities as well. She came home one day from an out-of-state work conference to her townhome covered in cameras, and her husband proposing to her that they abandon their life and move to an island off the coast of Europe.

SPEAKER_00: 39:02

Like, honey, do you want to talk about your day? Seems like a big jump.

SPEAKER_02: 39:07

Yeah. PSCO removed to Europe. Like ASAP. No red flags, sir. No, seriously.

SPEAKER_01: 39:15

Mark had shared with her that there were unfounded legal cases against him, but she had no idea the extent of what was brewing or truly what her husband had been up to. His medical staff also became wary of the doctor's behavior. He became snappy and short with patients, often ignoring their questions, not surprising when your visits are only three minutes long. Staff were also afraid of him, said a former employee. He also started coming to the office unkempt, where he used to be clean-shaven and well groomed. He started coming in with several days of stubble and would occasionally walk throughout the office not fully dressed. Oh.

SPEAKER_02: 39:51

What? Oh.

SPEAKER_00: 39:55

Like just no suit jacket, or are we missing a shirt altogether? We're not sure. Although. Can we get a red banner?

SPEAKER_01: 40:08

Oh, Rick Van Thielen. Take it off. I'm not sure. Did he forget his pants? I I I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_02: 40:17

What does that mean? Like, honestly.

SPEAKER_03: 40:21

I just want to put up a red banner. We're done with the flags. This is like a whole like red tape crime thing, crime scene situation. You cannot walk around as a physician. You can only do that in a camper trailer. Undress in your office. Okay, I've got to calm down. Oh boy. Oh boy.

SPEAKER_01: 40:41

I don't know if it was like your story from several weeks ago where the guy who was just free-balling it. I don't know, but un unclear. Unclear. Like to what degree of undressed are we? So many questions. So many questions. He also had 30 to 40 boxes delivered. Did those boxes contain medical supplies? No, they didn't. They contained a variety of camping and survivalist gear, which he would keep in a room that his employees dubbed the scary room. Why, why? Can you imagine working in a clinic where there's a scary room?

SPEAKER_03: 41:24

Can't go in there. The scary room. Out of the three of us, raise your hand if you would go into the scary room.

SPEAKER_01: 41:31

Make it known that Jenna and Shannon, oh, oh, and Amanda are raising their hand.

SPEAKER_00: 41:35

I think I would quit without having another job lined up. Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 41:42

Uh for sure.

SPEAKER_00: 41:45

As I'm like, I would quit without another job. Goodbye.

SPEAKER_03: 41:50

Well, you gotta see what's in there first, though, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 41:54

No, I don't need to because you guys are going in. You will text me later.

SPEAKER_03: 41:57

Oh my god, the scary room. Okay. Hurry on.

SPEAKER_01: 42:01

In September 2004, Mark planned an elaborate trip to Greece to celebrate his wife's 30th birthday. The trip involved him, his wife, her mother, her hairstylist, and several of her friends who were flown from Paris to Mykonos on that private jet that they were members of.

SPEAKER_03: 42:18

Privilege? Sorry. I always take my hairdresser with me wherever I go.

unknown: 42:24

Right?

SPEAKER_01: 42:26

I mean, I'd love to, but Yeah. Oh my gosh. Okay. Yeah. There he had arranged to meet his private yacht. However, it was late to arrive, and Mark was visibly nervous, although Michelle couldn't understand why. I mean, it's not like they couldn't afford to spend a night in a luxury hotel unplanned. She would later learn that the reason for his dismay was because he had previously sent a shipment of survival gear to Greece that was supposed to be on that yacht. But the yacht finally did arrive, and all was seemingly fine. Mark and his wife went to bed, and the next morning, Michelle woke up to find herself completely alone, the other side of the bed empty. Mark was gone. The yacht captain tried to reassure her with suggestions that maybe Mark simply went into town to buy her more birthday gifts. But when he still didn't show that night, she sounded the alarm and called the authorities. The yacht captain then confessed to her that he had spoken with a local taxi driver who had given Mark who had driven Mark to the airport earlier. Mark was not returning to the yacht. The yacht captain gave Michelle a phone number for a secret Greek cell phone that Mark had. And when she called it, she heard his familiar hello one final time. But once he realized that it was her on the line, the line went dead and she never heard from him again. What? So I'm like, what why didn't you just leave me at home? What? Wow. Right? So not only was Michelle heartbroken, I mean, sh the love of her life just left her. She was abandoned in Greece on her birthday, and she was left with next to nothing to figure out her life from there.

SPEAKER_00: 44:06

And he was like, Well, you at least you have your hairstylist, honey. You'll be fine. Your hair will look good. No roots will show. Your hair will be fine. Your hair will look good. You'll cry, but your hair will be fine.

SPEAKER_03: 44:17

How are we gonna pay this hairstylist?

SPEAKER_01: 44:19

I mean, holy cow. So she found on the yacht that Mark had left her 2,000 euros and her passport. He also left her a huge amount of debt. Oh.$30 million, according to Michelle.

SPEAKER_03: 44:35

Okay. Oh, okay. Thanks, dude.

SPEAKER_01: 44:39

Now, even though Mark was raking in millions of dollars a year, he did not really give Michelle access to that money. So she was not able to even afford a plane ticket to get back home.

SPEAKER_04: 44:54

Oh no, bless her heart.

SPEAKER_01: 44:56

She was not allowed to carry her own bank card or credit card. He would give her a cash allowance. So she ended up borrowing money from a family member in order to buy a plane ticket home.

SPEAKER_03: 45:08

Bless her heart.

SPEAKER_01: 45:09

She ultimately filed for bankruptcy in 2005 and listed more than six million dollars in liabilities.

SPEAKER_03: 45:14

Which was his, I'm sure. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 45:18

Oh, and she in the dateline, she recounts sitting at home, while like looking at her bank statements and seeing places that he is still spending money, like in Monaco and in Greece, and just at like luxury boutiques. Twist the knife.

SPEAKER_03: 45:34

So frustrating, angering, and hopelessness. You know, I can't imagine.

SPEAKER_00: 45:39

Leave me at our townhouse. Like just break up with me at home.

SPEAKER_01: 45:43

Right. Don't don't take me to a foreign country and just leave me there.

SPEAKER_00: 45:49

Especially when you know I can't get home, you jerk. Because they're not divorced, she's also on the hook for all of that.

SPEAKER_03: 45:56

For that debt.

SPEAKER_01: 45:58

And I yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 46:02

Awful.

SPEAKER_01: 46:03

So when Michelle returned to the US, she was stymied and needed answers. She went to his auntie office and began looking through his things. She found mounds of shredded paper, a useless attempt of Mark's to cover his tracks. Useless because Michelle was not deterred. And instead, she spent three nights piecing together shreds, piecing together these shreds of paper. Go, girl. Holy cow. This was the evidence she was looking for. It pointed to two trips to New York, where Mark had purchased$79,000 worth of diamonds.

SPEAKER_02: 46:37

What? Who does that?

SPEAKER_01: 46:40

Along with receipts totaling thousands of dollars for a variety of survival and camping equipment. She also found more credit card statements where she was able to track him to cities in France and Monaco, where despite being on the run and trying to hide, his luxurious spending habits persisted. What an idiot. Oh yeah. Even though he was on the run, he was not laying low. No. No. Michelle would eventually be able to bring her story to the masses when she detailed Mark's fraudulent behavior on America's Most Wanted in 2008.

SPEAKER_02: 47:13

Love that show.

SPEAKER_01: 47:15

The staff at his clinic was also baffled. He not only left his staff in alerch, but he left countless patients with nowhere to turn, which in hindsight, to me, they dodged a major bullet. Yeah, for sure. Staff did report, though, that after Mark disappeared, they began to notice large sums of money were disappearing from the business's bank accounts. So he wasn't only just bleeding Michelle dry, he was bleeding his business dry as well. Mark eventually landed in Cormaor, a ski resort village in northwest Italy, near the border of France and Switzerland in the Italian Alps. It was there that he met Monica Spaconia, an Italian woman in her late 30s, who found friendship in the fraudster. He told her he was a former stockbroker from Wall Street who had had enough of his stressful life in the U.S. and having made enough money to sustain a life abroad, set out to start over. In 2009, after living in Cormayor on and off for two years and building this relationship with Monica, he began to express deeper feelings to this woman, but he told her that future plans would need to be put on hold because he had some goals he wanted to reach first. He wanted to write a survival book. He also wanted to live alone along the side of a mountain for one year. Although he would still rely on Monica now and then for supplies.

SPEAKER_03: 48:35

Seriously? What's that about?

SPEAKER_01: 48:38

I don't even I have no idea what sort of weird quarterlife crisis that was, but so Mark may have disappeared into the snowy Italian countryside, but the lasting impact from the havoc he wrecked on his patients did not. His former patients continued to fight for justice, and after being nowhere to be found for two years, he was finally indicted by a grand jury in Indiana in 2006 for 22 counts of health care fraud for overbilling insurance companies, not only for surgical procedures that weren't medically necessary, but also for procedures that were never done at all. Also at this time, the FBI issued a warrant for his arrest.

SPEAKER_03: 49:17

Yeah, boy, they come for you.

SPEAKER_01: 49:20

So Mark's friend Monica received word, seemingly out of the blue, from a friend of hers about Mark's deception. This friend of hers informed her that something was not right with Mark, that he was not who he said he was. This friend of hers gave Monica his real name, which she then searched for online and found his fugitive status on the America's Most Wanted website. But by that point, Monica had unfortunately already fallen for Mark and his unwavering charm. She had a decision to make. Good job, Monica.

unknown: 49:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 50:00

Right? Good job, Monica.

SPEAKER_04: 50:02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 50:02

So sort of kind of this is all happening kind of simultaneously. But while Mark is living along the side of the mountain, he no longer needs this apartment that he had been renting. So what does one do when you no longer need an apartment? Well, you simply abandon it and stop paying for the company. Well, of course.

unknown: 50:19

Right?

SPEAKER_00: 50:19

Isn't that what you mean?

SPEAKER_01: 50:20

Well, yeah, sure.

SPEAKER_00: 50:21

Yeah. He's not worried about getting a deposit back. He doesn't care.

SPEAKER_01: 50:28

So uh yeah. So after months of overdue rent, this rental agent contacted the Italian police force, which was only shortly after Monica had also gone to the police. And this helped solidify her story. The rental agency was able to supply Mark's legitimate passport photo from when he first rented the apartment. This guy was not lying low. He is he was he's not smart. He gave them his legitimate passport. No. And they thankfully still had it and turned it over. When the Italian police ran Mark's information, they were surprised to learn that he was a wanted fugitive with an arrest warrant out from Interpol. Because Monica had remained in contact with him as a resource for his supplies, she was able to direct the police to his shelter. At this point, it's late 2009, and Mark had been on the run from U.S. officials for five years. When the Italian police approached Mark, he was compliant, although he gave them a fake name, Mock Weinberg. Because he had no proper he couldn't even come up with something a little different than his real name. Like something different?

SPEAKER_03: 51:41

Like, I don't know, George. Dude, get some imagination. What the hell?

SPEAKER_01: 51:47

Because because he had no proper identification on him, he was brought into the station for further questioning, where he admitted to being a divorced surgeon from the United States. After some time, the police asked him outright if he was in fact Mark Weinberger, to which he said yes. He was arrested and searched. Mark, realizing his jig was up, began to devise a new escape plan. During a break to use the restroom, Mark, despite having been checked for weapons, pulled out a concealed pocket knife and stabbed himself in the side of the neck.

SPEAKER_03: 52:19

Oh, goodness.

SPEAKER_01: 52:20

Ah. Some believe it was a suicide attempt because he realized he was caught. However, the wound was rather superficial and he survived. What did his ex-wife Michelle think of this supposed suicide attempt? That it was nothing more than a manipulative act on Mark's behalf to land himself in the hospital rather than a prison. To like try to get out on Oh, like an insanity or something? Yeah. Good point. He was extradited back to the United States in 2011, where he faced 22 counts of healthcare fraud and hundreds of lawsuits that had piled up against him. A medical malpractice settlement in Indiana involving 282 former patients of Dr. Weinberger's granted them a share of$55 million. He initially tried to arrange a plea deal, agreeing to plead guilty if he only had to serve four years in prison. The judge on the case said, hell no, and throughout the judge, he'd be going to trial.

SPEAKER_02: 53:14

Go judge.

SPEAKER_01: 53:16

In 2012, during his long-awaited criminal trial, he ultimately did plead guilty to all 22 counts, telling the court, I'm sorry. I lied, I stole, I betrayed a sacred trust. He was sentenced to only seven years behind bars. He was released to a halfway house in 2000. Don't even get me started, and uh, seven years. I was talking about it with Matt yesterday. We think it's because he didn't directly like kill anybody that it was all just medical fraud and malpractice, but still, isn't seven years so infuriating?

SPEAKER_04: 53:54

Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 53:55

Especially with how many counts it was, just oh my God. So infuriating. He was released to a halfway house in 2014, which means he ended up serving less than five years in total when you factor in time he was granted for time served while awaiting his trial. And just what he did he do with his new life upon being released early? Well, he settled down in Florida with a new wife and two children. And despite having had his medical license permanently revoked in 2005, he found a new way to be referred to as doctor. As of 2021, he was going by the new moniker, the Yoga Doc, touting his expertise in yoga with classes aimed at turning you from a nerd to a ninja, from a zero to a superhero. Okay. Settle down, dude.

unknown: 54:45

Gosh.

SPEAKER_01: 54:47

On his website, you could purchase downloadable classes for upwards of$200. He also claims that the two reasons people work out is to get hot chicks and look good naked. Well, of course. Not for any of the other health benefits that yoga has. Like, bro. It thankfully does not seem like his disgusting yoga practice is still in business. And I am not sure what he's currently up to today. And to be honest, I am not really interested in finding out, nor do I care. I'm just thankful he's not actually practicing true medicine medicine. But that is the story of Indiana's infamous nose doc, Mark Weinberger.

SPEAKER_00: 55:32

What a little scallyway. Wow.

SPEAKER_03: 55:40

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_00: 55:43

Um I'm like, I'm still so pissed for Michelle that he flew her to another country to go on a yacht and then left her there. Like, why the fuck didn't you just leave me at home?

SPEAKER_01: 55:59

Why all the pretense? Like it just break up with me. Just I know that's not what I should be upset about about this story, but I'm just No, I know. But still, she I feel like so is she even in so in the Dateline episode and the dateline that I watched is an update. Like they interviewed her, I think it was back in 2011, but Peacock's Dateline, I don't think, went back that far. So I couldn't watch that original one. But she's so great. She's like, she talks about how you know she really couldn't have done a lot of this without Monica, who turned him in and and really helped to bring it all down. So she said that it was it was a big tag team effort. So I I just I thought that was great. And like we mentioned earlier, she, you know, she went on, she finished her degree, and she didn't let this this big old puke bag bring her down.

SPEAKER_03: 56:53

I can't believe that there were 350 cases against him, and that's all he got as as as punishment.

SPEAKER_01: 57:01

So what's this is this is not wild in terms of like the case at all, but as I was watching, so first off, when I watched this Dateline episode, this was back when I was still living in Minnesota, so Indiana was like the furthest thing from my mind. I hadn't even met yet Matt yet. And then I'm like, oh my God, here I am in Indiana, and I'm re-watching it again. And who pops up on the TV but the lawyer who helps defend Phyllis, the first case woman? And I'm like, oh my God, I recognize that man from all his billboards on the highway. Oh my gosh, that's funny. He's like a big personal injury lawyer, and I'm like, oh my god. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_03: 57:41

I know. I was like, oh look. So Phyllis was the 47-year-old who saw Dr. Weinberger in 2001. She was the one with the throat.

SPEAKER_01: 57:49

Yeah, she was the one with the big old throat cancer who ended up with a laringectomy that even a medical student could should have caught. That's that one is the one that makes me really mad because there are just some things you don't want you that should keep you up at night and it's missing a cancer. Oh, I was gonna say, but if that if that had been caught early enough, she could have potentially avoided a laringectomy. Like the reasons she got, she ended up getting a laringectomy, she ended up like being rushed to the ER because she couldn't breathe and they did an emergency trick. Like it all escalated very fast.

SPEAKER_03: 58:23

So talk to us about for those listeners who aren't familiar with the functional impact of a laringectomy. What does that mean for a person?

SPEAKER_01: 58:34

I mean, it it takes away your ability to effectively communicate. You you you now have it's it's different than if anyone's familiar with a trache. A trache is another means to allow you to breathe. So these are all tubes that are are surgically inserted into your trachea to allow you to breathe if you have some sort of obstruction above, you know, above that level. So it's an incision into your neck, a hole in your neck that allows you to breathe. With with a trache, you can plug that up and be able to talk because you can breathe around it in some cases, if that's not what you're entirely relying on to breathe, because you still have your nasal airway, you know, it really all depends on where your obstruction is. What's different with the laryngectomy is this is actually taking your trachea and tying it to the outside of your neck. So if you block that up, you cannot breathe. There is no breathing through your nose anymore. Your nose and your mouth are no longer connected to your airway. So if you've ever swallowed and been like, it went down the wrong pipe, that can't happen anymore if you have a laryngectomy because those tubes are no longer in the same spot.

SPEAKER_03: 59:59

So where is your where is your thyroid? Where is your your vocal folds and your ability to use air to make speech? So in that scenario.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:11

So your vocal cords are so your thyroid is here, more on the outside of your neck. Your vocal cords are behind that, but with olaryngectomy, all of that is being removed. Your vocal cords, your vocal folds, the cartilage that's there, that's all being removed.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:30

Okay. So your your ability to voice and talk is gone.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:36

Gone. Gone. So you use what's called what is that device called?

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:43

So like a communication board or some other way.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:47

You can't use your Yeah, it's that thing that you like the Yes Tobacco. Electro, an electrolynx. That's what it's called. An electrolarynx.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:57

Okay. Electrolarynx, which uses the vibration.

SPEAKER_01: 1:01:01

Yeah. It's honestly if you can remember those commercials from the 90s that were like, don't smoke, and it's those people with those robotic voices.

SPEAKER_03: 1:01:09

Yeah. Yeah. Don't smoke. It's terrible. Yeah. Oh, that was really good, Jenna. Thank you. But like a huge, I don't think we can underestimate because to communicate is human. Whether you're doing that through manual communication with sign language, or or most of us are are using spoken language and listening. So to be to take to lose that through the ineptitude of some arsehole is just indescribable to me.

SPEAKER_01: 1:01:44

Yeah. And then it's also, you know, she was a relatively young woman. It's also the physical appearance. Like you now have a hole in your neck that has a device in your neck, which can become infected. You can have mucus come flying out of it, drainaged from the neck. There's no good way to cover it up. Sometimes you can get what's called lymphedema, where because they've mucked around in the neck, your lymphatic drainage is obstructed. And so things above that will get all swollen and your face and neck and head can get swollen. And so you can deal with a lot of physical issues, the voice issues. I'm sure she dealt with some, you know, socialization isolation issues just because she was probably, I don't want to speak for her, but I'm sure she was self-conscious. I shouldn't say that. I don't want to speak for her.

SPEAKER_03: 1:02:40

No, but I mean, one could imagine that if we were in that situation, that that's how we would feel.

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:46

Well, not only that, but he ruined the opportunity for possibly that whole tumor being removed for mucking up her sinuses.

SPEAKER_03: 1:02:55

Similarly, with the eight-year-old Kayla that was brought to Dr. Weinberger, who had headaches and was dizzy and nauseous, and decided, well, it was her sinuses. She was eight years old. I mean, that's not the protocol. You don't operate on eight-year-old sinuses. They're not done growing in their heads yet. Right.

unknown: 1:03:17

Right.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03:17

Right. So he went in there anyway, yeah. And then created so much scar tissue they couldn't get to most of the tumor.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:24

Right. They could only remove 10% of it. So this tumor grew with her as she grew. And I I don't know how it affected her as she grew, because your pituitary gland affects growth. Thankfully, it seems like she's thriving.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03:41

Yeah. She had to undergo these invasive surgeries that were not only unnecessary, but possibly devastating, you know, or obstruct at the very least, obstructing their ability to actually help her. So I'm I'm really, really not a fan of Weinberger. Did you tell it? I I was so mad. I didn't I don't remember what you said he ended up doing. I know it was too short.

SPEAKER_01: 1:04:07

So he got sentenced to seven years in jail, was he essentially spent less than five years total when factored in, all of like the time served. He was released in what year was he released? Oh 14, that's what I was gonna say. Yeah, released in 2014. So another thing is he part of his like arrangement is he was able to serve his time in Florida. Like I didn't know you could just choose where you got to do it. I don't think that's a thing. Your time.

SPEAKER_03: 1:04:40

I'm sorry. I'm not a criminal, but can I serve some time in Florida?

SPEAKER_01: 1:04:44

I'm tired of just gonna winter keep right. I'm sorry. Uh I think that's where his I think I think if I remember correctly, I should have written this down. It was to be closer to his father, who was down in Florida. Again, his father matters, but Michelle's doesn't. His father, Michelle's, yeah. So that's why he was released then in Florida, remarried, unclear if the two children were from a previous marriage or if those are his children, and then started this yoga online business, which thankfully I don't think is still around.

SPEAKER_00: 1:05:20

Well, yeah, because you know you gotta get hot tricks and look good naked.

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:25

Listen, thank you for a fascinating case. You did a great job. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01: 1:05:32

Thank you guys for having me on.

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:34

It's well, I mean, when you get a couple things left to do, but I think what do you think, Amanda? Do you think we need to have a regular spot for this young lady here? Because I mean, that was pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_00: 1:05:49

I I'd say if she's up for it, I'm up for it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:05:53

I would say absolutely we want more of where that came from. So thank you, Shesser. No, no, that's her coworker.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:04

Thank you, Shannon.

SPEAKER_03: 1:06:06

Good lord. Okay. It's supposed to be an affectionate thing. I don't know your coworker, so she's nice.

SPEAKER_01: 1:06:13

She's great. I just don't like nicknames.

SPEAKER_03: 1:06:15

All right. No nicknames for you. No nicknames for you. Speaking of nicknames, we have a sponsor called Quantum Squares. I don't know what we want to call them quanti, like as a nickname, but that was my segue. Uh for they are redefining energy stacks with scientifically formulated energy bars to provide long-lasting, stable energy without crashes. Developed by scientists, each bar combines whole food ingredients with 100 milligrams of organic caffeine, yup baby, equivalent to an eight-ounce coffee, ensuring a smooth energy boost. These bars deliver balanced nutrition featuring 10 grams of plant-based protein, healthy fats, and complex carbohydrates, making them an ideal choice for active individuals like us. Quantum squares are certified gluten-free, non-GMO, plant-based, kosher, vegan, dairy-free, and soy-free. And everybody's happy because there's no artificial additives or sugar alcohols or anything that anyone can get upset by. So get your quantum squares because they offer delicious flavors like peanut butter, dark chocolate, and dark chocolate, pink Himalayan salt. Mm-mm. With over 2,500 five-star reviews, customers rave about their taste and effectiveness in combating afternoon slumps and providing clean and consistent energy. Quantum Squares commitment to quality and transparency ensures that each bar is delicious and a healthier, smarter alternative to conventional energy snacks. Hurry because this deal expires on October 31st, 2025. Visit QuantumSquares.com. That's Q-U-A-N-T-U-M S-Q-U-A-R-E-S.com and use our promo code STAYSUSPIOUS for 25% off today. And now it's time for medical mishap. We don't normally sing for that, but I just feel so like I feel so jubilant because of our guest. Okay. So this week's medical mishap comes from a listener that discovered that sometimes the scariest part of surgery isn't the procedure, it's the pre-op chaos that happens before anyone even picks up a scalpel. Oh my goodness. All right. It starts Dear Jenna and Amanda, I love your podcast and your take on true crime in healthcare. I've learned so many things. Throughout the months, I've listened diligently and I've learned about when an autopsy is or is not done, when a person dies, the lack of regulations surrounding organ and body donations, the dangers of unregulated supplements, marijuana psychosis, how to advocate how to advocate for my own health and wellness, verify provider credentials, and how to stay safe in an MRI suite. Look at how much we've learned, people same. I mean, we we're all learning together. So not to mention all the dodgy dentists out there. No offense to my dentist, Dr. Thomason. You aren't in that group, says the writer here. Dr. Thomason has been marked safe. You're not part of the crazy dentists. I appreciate your rye sense of humor and sensitivity of the victims in each case. I will literally pee with glee if you read about this on the pod. Listen, get your adult actress out, lady, because we doing it.

SPEAKER_00: 1:09:50

I want to add that to my like life. Pee with glee.

SPEAKER_03: 1:09:57

Bless your heart. Oh my goodness. Okay, so then she goes on to say, on to my story. I was scheduled for a minor surgery, a laparoscopic gallbladder removal. I'd had the gallstones, the pain, the whole gallbladder, greatest hits tour. I was nervous, but mostly just ready to stop feeling like I swallowed a handful of gravel. Oh bless your heart. The hospital told me to arrive at 5 30 a.m. sharp. The world was asleep, and so apparently was the pre-op staff. Oh no. The nurse through my IV looked about 12 years old. I know she wasn't, but her badge said student nurse intern, which didn't help my confidence. She was sweet, but she was shaky. Like literally shaky. You know how you can tell someone's trying really hard to look calm. She missed my vein. No big deal, it happens, but then she missed again. And again. And by the third attempt, my arm looked like a connect the dots puzzle. Finally, she called in another nurse who got it in one smooth motion and whispered, Don't worry, we all start somewhere. I wanted to say, yeah, but preferably not inside my arm. I was trying to be supportive. So my reward was a bruise the size of a kiwi that lasted longer than my surgical stitches. Next, the surgeon came by with a sharpie to mark which side he was operating on. Standard safety protocol. He drew a big arrow on my right side. Perfect. Then, as he walked away, he spun back and said, Wait, was it your left? No. Oh no. Every cell in my body froze. But then he laughed and he said, Ah, just kidding, and moved on. I laughed too because I didn't want to start crying before anesthesia. I hadn't eaten in 12 hours, so my stomach was auditioning for sound effects. Real. The nurse offered me a cup of lemon jello for later and set it on my bedside trait. Why would she do that? That's so cruel. Like, why even bring it in the room? Oh, whatever. So the anesthesiologist came by, checked my chart, and deadpan. Who gave the patient food? I panicked, thinking I had broken some pre-op rule, but being in the same rule as is the same room as gelatin. They both assured me it was fine, but not before making me promise not to elope with the jello. I told them I'd keep our love on the down low. When I woke up after surgery, groggy and full of morphine dreams, my first question was, Did we save the gallbladder? The nurse said, Well, it's in a little medical waste bag somewhere. You're free. I told her, I wanted to name it Greg. My spouse says that I said that with tears in my eyes, like a soldier saying goodbye to a fallen comrade. I want to name him Greg. A few hours later, a different nurse came to remove my IV. She yanked the tape off like she was starting a lawnmower. Oh, dang. I squeaked and she apologized and said, Well, we're out of a heats of remover. Well, but I mean, seriously, lady, take it slow. Wow. I'm sorry, where did you go? She then gave me my discharge instructions, which I only realized later were for a patient named Daniel who was 64 and diabetic. Oh no. I'm neither, but we both apparently weren't supposed to lift anything heavier than a milk jug for two weeks. So I followed those orders anyway.

SPEAKER_00: 1:13:45

Again, I'm like, where did you go?

SPEAKER_03: 1:13:49

That's entirely in. In the end, everything went fine. I'm gallbladder free, and Greg has presumably gone to a medical waste heaven. But I still think about the intern, the cello, and the surgeon's fake out joke. I mean, medicine isn't always about drama or danger. Sometimes it's just deeply human. A bunch of tired, overworked people trying their best not to kill you before sunrise. Thank you. If you read this on the pod, stay safe and stay suspicious of surgeons who aren't sure which side of the body the gallbladder is on. Love Megan. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00: 1:14:26

I love that she has empathy for people that are just tired and overworked, but couldn't be that's a good sport.

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:33

Yeah. What if Daniel was there to have his like appendix out and then the person and they got a call on the appendix out of the gallery? Like, what if they got like what if, or just what if they, I mean, obviously, ah, just oh god.

SPEAKER_00: 1:14:47

This stresses me out.

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:49

What if it was a whole mix-up?

SPEAKER_03: 1:14:50

Oh well, she didn't lift anything heavy, um, which probably was good after gallbladder surgery, but I'm worried about the guy that should have gotten those instructions. Oh god. The diabetic. Like, what uh and why are you bringing people food that they can't eat yet? It's gonna sit there and get rid of it. Yeah, here's stare at this. I hope you're not too hungry. I don't know. What do you do? Oh, bless your heart. Thanks, Megan, for writing that in. That's really given us pause to think and basically freak out about what is happening in healthcare at the moment.

SPEAKER_01: 1:15:25

Hope your pants are still dry, Megan.

SPEAKER_03: 1:15:28

Yeah, Megan! Listen, I think the fact what a what a beautiful soul that she gives everyone the benefit of the doubt at the end of the day, and she's just like, well, people are overworked and tired, and they're just trying their best. And like Bara said it like, let's not kill people. Like, that's the bark. Well, I honestly think that's probably true for most of what we do these days, unfortunately. Yeah. Well, Shannon, thank you so much for joining us today. It's been so much fun.

SPEAKER_00: 1:16:01

Hey, thank you guys for having me. Whenever you want, girl. Open invitation. No pressure. We say stop it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:16:10

Can we say whenever we want?

SPEAKER_01: 1:16:12

Stop it. Yes. If you ever, if you ever get if you ever guys get sick, let me know.

SPEAKER_03: 1:16:19

Yeah. Okay. This is how we start to rope you and to be a regular.

SPEAKER_00: 1:16:24

You'll just have to have a case on standby then if you're waiting for someone to.

SPEAKER_03: 1:16:28

It'll be shout-out Shannon.

SPEAKER_04: 1:16:32

Maternity leave.

SPEAKER_03: 1:16:34

Yeah. I'm feeling sick next week. Get on that, girly. But meanwhile, what can our list what now?

SPEAKER_01: 1:16:44

Oh, I just was just saying, I can have a case on standby.

SPEAKER_03: 1:16:47

Oh, well, you say it. Yeah, for sure. Love that. Make it happen. It's it's out there around the universe. It's it has to happen. Um, so Shannon's gonna be back. But meanwhile, next week, Amanda, what can our listeners expect?

SPEAKER_00: 1:17:07

The only thing I'm gonna tell you is that we're going over to England. Yes. Britain. Because sometimes I'm like, if I give you the name, are people gonna look it up? I don't want you to look it up. Just know we're going to England.

SPEAKER_03: 1:17:19

Okay. I'm so excited because you know, part of me is British.

SPEAKER_00: 1:17:25

But that's the only exciting thing about it. The rest is honestly just trash bags full of garbage. Well, that's what we're speaking for.

SPEAKER_03: 1:17:32

That's the meat of the matter. Am I right?

SPEAKER_00: 1:17:34

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So until then, don't miss a beat. Subscribe or following Doctoring the Truth wherever you enjoy your podcast for stories that shock, intrigue, and educate. Trust, after all, is a delicate thing. You can text us directly on our website at doctoringthe truth at bestroute.com. Email us your own story ideas, medical mishaps, and comments at Doctoringthe Truth at Gmail. And be sure to follow us on Instagram at Doctoring the Truth Podcast and Facebook at Doctoring the Truth. We're on TikTok at Doctoring the Truth and at oddpod. Don't forget to download rate and review so we can be sure to bring you more content next week. Until then, stay safe and stay sufficient.

SPEAKER_03: 1:18:20

Do you want to do it again? Oh well shall we?

SPEAKER_00: 1:18:23

Let's do a stage. Well, we're just a bunch of alley cats, aren't we?

SPEAKER_04: 1:18:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 1:18:36

Okay. Goodbye.